Jan -- Thread hijacker! Some cats do lay in this meatloaf position because they are cats. The difference is how tense they are (ill = more tense), the position of the head (ill = head down), and responsiveness (ill = not very responsive, but not sleeping).

Clancy was very eager for breakfast this morning -- good.
He ate most of his food -- good. (He has trouble with the 'crumbs'.)
He was wetting his facing without drinking much -- not good (probably from the ulcers)

So the phospohorus binder is working on the stomach/eating. The bicarbonate probably can get rid of the the mouth ulcers, but the big problem is you need 2-3 hrs. between the binder and the bicarbonate, or those two react and not do much for the cat. Also, I'm not home during the day to give it to him and it would be nearly impossible for hubby to do it -- Clancy is a reluctant patient. He's going to get fluids today and tomorrow and then every third day and see how that works.

I still can't believe I'm having to use a phosphorus binder. Of all the CRF cats I've had, he's the first. I have always figured that it had to do with the raw meat not producing hybrid proteins like cooked meat does. While that is true, I suppose at the end-stage the phosphorus would build up. Most cats, however, get to the phosphorus problems long before mouth ulcers. I do wonder if his thyroid problems are contributing to the mess somehow.

Linda, how my heart goes out to you during this gruelling and highly emotional time with your little Clancy. Your poor heart... all these ups and downs... so incredibly tough.

My thoughts and prayers are sent for your sweet baby, bless his dear little heart.
And bless you too Linda. You've gone far above and beyond the call in helping Clancy, as you do with all of your babies.
What an exceptional blessing each little one has been graced with, to have you as their loving and committed caregiver

Thanks for the meatloaf explanation... I didnt know what this meant either.
Dont know what a phosphorus binder is either.... but if it's helping your Clancy, that's good
Hugs, prayers and all positive wishes, Linda.

When the kidneys begin to fail, one thing that happens is a build-up of phosphorus in the digestive tract. Phosphorus is involved in protein digestion and usually the phosphorus enters the blood and is flushed out by the kidneys. With CRF, the blood becomes saturated because the kidneys fall 'behind' on phosphorus removal, so it stays in the digestive tract. The build-up basically of phosphoric acid (I think -- Barbara, I'm tired so my chem is slipping... ) causes distress and leads to not eating, drooling, meatloaf position, vomiting, etc. A phosphorus binder binds the excess phosphorus so it is pooped out and doesn't have to go through the kidneys.

In this case, the phosphorus binder is Maalox. And for short term, it's find, but the high level of magnesium can cause kidney stones in long-term use. I'll get some aluminum hydroxide which can be used long term.

I know zip about biochemistry and phosphorylation, so all I can say is that stuff like Maalox or aluminum hydroxide will react with the excess phosphoric acid in the stomach to produce an insoluble substance (a precipitate) that cannot pass into the blood stream and is pooped out. It is not phosphorus, the element, but phosphate ions that are removed in this fashion. Phosphate ions become phosphoric acid in the highly acidic stomach juices.

Well, gee, now that you are retired, isn't it about time you learn? Then I don't have to think about biochem! Or even organic!

Linda so glad to hear that its working. was wondering to talk to you yesterday and you sounded tired too my friend. Lots of cat magic love and good thoughts coming your way for Clancy and you. As you said its quality of life not quantity and you are doing a wonderful job. You never cease to amaze me with your wisdom knowledge and practicality


give that special boy more smooches from me and the gang and tell him we all love him

I'm glad Clancy is feeling a little better. I hope he continues to do well.

So happy to hear Clancy is doing somewhat "well".
I hope this continues for you and him for a long time to come.
My prayers and positive thoughts are with your dear little man...

I see Dolly sitting in this "meatloaf" position more and more...
she makes me happy when she moves from that postion to lay in
a more of a curled up cat fashion way.....

Hugs,
Joan

Just a very quick update -- Clancy is still doing well. He gets maalox 10-20 minutes before a meal, and azodyl in the morning and night. He didn't drool at all today and is now cleaning his plate. The latter is important because the mouth ulcers were preventing this, so I'm guessing they are also smaller or less painful.

And last night, he meowed for half an hour as he brought dog toys to the bedroom door... My psycho kitty is baaaack!

Here's to psycho kitties and the mommies who love them and care for them!